Gay WHAT???

Published on July 30, 2004 By wnx_decoy In Current Events

What is wrong with this world? Am I just stupid or was the U.S. Constituition written while under the influence of a God fearing belief?

If the constition was written under those principles than why do the people who are also God fearing, have to refrain from using his holy name in public? People honestly wanted to change our 200+ year old pledge just because it includes the word God. And what's even worse is that I have to sit back and listen to people curse while using God's name. Maybe I'm just a crazy christian that is too blind to no the difference, but I don't think that's it.

I have the strangest feeling our forefathers didn't mean that you can't practice religion in the U.S. just that you can't FORCE your religion upon someone. Saying the pledge is not forcing christian ethics upon anyone, it's just asking Americans to have some respect for their country.

Gays can get married, legally, now. All I have to say about this one is, keep them out of court rooms and churches when doing this, because the church is (or at least mine is) against homosexual marriages. Then you have the court rooms which have the american flag right in your face.

If you haven't noticed yet, I'm a christian and I can't stand the fact that we are letting people like this get away with what they are doing. You don't see me going around yelling at people for not praying, so why yell at me FOR praying? I'm not even speaking for crying out loud.

Oh, and then there's schools... This sucks big one's! You don't have to pledge anymore and the principal can't ask you to take time to pray and/or meditate. I remember, in 3rd grade, we would always do morning pledge and then the moment of silence for prayer or meditation. It was harmless. If you don't want to pray, you had time to sit and think. If you wanted to pray and not feel weird you could. Suddenly, out of nowhere we weren't aloud to do those things anymore. Now, to pray you look like a freak and everyone thinks your a loser that doesn't deserve to have friends.

So, what am I? Am I an idiot for even thinking that God is good? Maybe that's why we're having so much trouble in this world now. People won't accept that God isn't a word to bind you into one religion, but a word to symbolize the greatness of our country... if you won't accept it as a holy being. Or perhaps I'm a psychotic homophobe who can't even function in the same world as a homosexual or bisexual (no real dif.).

Capt. over and out!

Comments (Page 8)

106

carebear07

on Aug 04, 2004

i gotcha now. you do understand the difference between someone pretending to be attracted to the same sex and someone who has always only been attracted to the same sex or who finds both sexes equally attractive?

Yes i do.

As shades said, this is your OPINION. It may be based on what your pastor told you, or on other sources of information, but unless you have documented evidence to back it up, we will continue to consider it your opinion.

Well if it's mine and Capt.'s OPINION to think that people are not born gay. Then it makes it your OPINION that you think people are born gay, right?

nmrhth~ omg. thank you so much. you are the only one really making sense on here!!!

~carebear~

107

Pearlcaster

on Aug 05, 2004

Christianity is a proselytising religion like Islam. The reason Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world is that it has the courage of its convictions, knows how and where to best express them to gain converts, and is a real presence in the life of its adherents. Conversely Christianity, having lost its balls long ago, is in chronic decline - at least in terms of numbers of church-going believers.

There was a time when the church had clear and simple measures for those who resented having the Gospels 'shoved in their face' all day. They were taken to the nearest torture chamber, shown the implements of torture, and told that if they didn't recant their heresy then Holy Mother Church would seriously fuck em up. And then burn them alive.

Where's the Inquisition when you need it, eh?
Come back Torquemada, all is forgiven!!

108

Splateaux

on Aug 05, 2004

Okay, so it's time to do some quoting now:

Though you may not go along with the facts, you are NOT born gay

I'll not take the time to point out how silly of a statement this is. A few other people have already done a good job of that.

I'm sorry I put you into your "grumpy mode" but I don't see how saying that Christians are stupid is going to win your arguments. My mom, for example, is the 2nd highest paid woman for the business she works at. She also has her own company that she runs on the side. She's a website designer, and a dang good one too. She's a christian, so of course what I just told you is false because she must be too stupid to do what she does.

Dude, the next time you think you're going to be cool by saying that my "family" is stupid, maybe you should think twice. You just look like your some idiot who can't find people to listen to him without lashing out!

To those of you who keep referring to Christians as persons who blindly follow what they are told and have no intelligence, I resent that.

In my earlier post, I never referred to anyone as being stupid or having no intelligence. If you really wanted one word to use to illustrate how I described most, and I do say most not all, Christians, bigot would be a better choice:

A person who regards his own faith and views in matters of religion as unquestionably right, and any belief or opinion opposed to or differing from them as unreasonable or wicked. In an extended sense, a person who is intolerant of opinions which conflict with his own, as in politics or morals; one obstinately and blindly devoted to his own church, party, belief, or opinion.

Giving me a resume of your mothers accomplishments doesn’t really disprove your bigotry.

You don’t necessarily have to view being a bigot as a bad thing though. It just means that any logic or reason others use to try and make you understand their points is wasted. You believe what you believe because of one or a few of my earlier mentioned reasons.

One solution to the gay marriage situation would be this. Remove the title of marriage from federal and state law. Instead, replace it with the term civil union, or something else. allow both homosexual and heterosexual couples to form civil unions. classify marriages performed within churches as civil unions. that way, gays will have a way of joining together in love, along with receiving the tax benefits that now only come from marriage. also, Christians and others opposed to gay marriage because it violates the sanctity would be able to preserve this sanctity, without disadvantaging the gay community.

Really good idea! Although, you could almost do that now if you cared a little less about the “title” that your union is given. I don’t believe gay couples getting married are going to want to go to YOUR church to get hitched. So, you could just recognize the difference between be married in a church which you consider valid, and married by a Justice of the Peace which wouldn’t hold the same high status.

109

citahellion

on Aug 05, 2004

Well if it's mine and Capt.'s OPINION to think that people are not born gay. Then it makes it your OPINION that you think people are born gay, right?

Yes, that is my opinion.
But please don't bother trying to claim that any opinion is just as good as any other. An opinion is only as good as the thought and the knowledge that went into forming it.

110

shadesofgrey

on Aug 05, 2004

Well if it's mine and Capt.'s OPINION to think that people are not born gay. Then it makes it your OPINION that you think people are born gay, right?

Yes, as citahellion says, it's an opinoin. However, unlike Capt, we never stated that it was FACT.

Though you may not go along with the facts, you are NOT born gay

111

citahellion

on Aug 05, 2004

Actually, I need to re-state my opinion. I do not believe that sexual orientation is determined at the time of birth by your genetic structure. So in that regard, Captain and Carebear, I agree with you.
Where I differ from you is in your apparent belief (and I say "apparent" because I'm not going to go back and look for exact quotes) that being gay, or giving up gayness, is a conscious choice.
There are many genetic factors that may predispose one toward becoming gay when proper environmental conditions are met. My understanding and belief is that sexual orientation is determined by a combination of one's predisposition and one's early childhood environment. What genetic or environmental factors specifically influence sexual orientation, I do not know. However, by the time a child is becoming sexually aware, their preferences have long since been determined.

112

carebear07

on Aug 05, 2004

Yes, as citahellion says, it's an opinoin. However, unlike Capt, we never stated that it was FACT

Yes, I know that you never said it was a fact. I'm just trying to get everything straight here so I don't confuse myself.

Wow, someone is actually agreeing with us.

~carebear~

113

Lord Shitzu

on Aug 05, 2004

I mean sure some of the people might not believe in the same God, but still.

There is the essence of why atheists like me have a distaste for Christians, and why we "dig their feet in" like someone said and protest religion being inserted into secular issues.

What you're basically saying is:
"Sure some people don't believe in the same god, or any god, but... but still... come on... who cares, right?"

You say that "God" could mean any god, be it Zeus or Buddha, but then again anyone who believed in Zeus would call him Zeus, not God, and what of all the other gods such a person believed in? And the Buddha's not "God" either, but an enlightened being. Of course I'm sure you'd say it's all the same. It's all the same to you because it's not your beliefs being trivialized or marginalized, how would you feel if I said in relation to your beliefs: "Yeah, just some god and his Jesus kid, who's god too or something, or maybe not, it depends on who you ask, but who cares anyway, point is it's a god."

And then there are atheists like me, who just get so annoyed when we see this stuff surrounding us and being forced in our faces when we think it's all bullshit anyway. You say even if I don't believe in God I should respect your right to be proud of your belief. Well I have a right to be proud of my non-belief, because I happen to believe myself a free thinker, and that makes me proud. But if you want to express support for your country, I don't force you to say: "..one nation, under no gods whatsoever, because gods are stupid, and those who believe in them are sheep, indivisible..."

That would be rude, and it's just as rude to have to call this one nation under god, as though it were a given that there's a god.

114

wnx_decoy

on Aug 05, 2004

So, what you just said is, someone doesn't understand Christianity so they generalize, and therefore it's bad? No, I think you have issues to sort out before trying to say I'm being rude like that. I'll admit that I am being rude, but I'm trying to leave other religions out of the conversation as much as possible because I'm not "educated" enough in them. Pardon me for not studying something I don't believe in. And I don't care if you generalize about something you don't know about, as long as you're willing to admit that you don't know what you're talking about.

Humility is a lesson that needs to be taught more often. None of you will accept when you can't even prove your point anymore. I admitted it a while ago, yet you continue to try and make me look bad just because I believe in something you don't. Give it up. You all seem "smart". Why don't we just agree to disagree, unless you want to keep arguing with one of the most stuborn teens on JU. I'd be glad to throw mud as long as you are... Feel free.

Capt. over and out!

115

Lord Shitzu

on Aug 05, 2004

You're right it's pointless arguing with your type of people.

All the best thought out and truly excellent arguments against your position that others have made you dismiss with a one-liner and a smily.

Here's an example:

citahellion's impressive, well thought out explanation of why we believe that gay people who have become born again are supressing their TRUE NATURE, including a great metaphor in the idea of wearing women's clothing does not make you a woman. It also explains not just WHY we think this way, but also what exactly it IS that we think.

and your response:

So, having hormones is a sin? Can I get an A-men?

Capt. over and out!

(you guys are killing me)

Way to entirely ignore what he said and make a joke of a serious argument.

It pains me to see other peoples' well thought out arguments dismissed like that. At least most of those opposing your view take the time to fully read and fully respond to your thoughts.

116

Splateaux

on Aug 05, 2004

Pardon me for not studying something I don't believe in.

Shew!! You should count yourself lucky then that you happened to have been born here and were exposed to the right religion right off the bat! You would have really been screwed, and damned to hell I guess, if you would have been born somewhere else in the world and wouldn't have had a chance to find to find the truth!

Lucky guy!

117

carebear07

on Aug 06, 2004

You're right it's pointless arguing with your type of people.

Well if it's pointless then why are you doing it too? Or are you?

Way to entirely ignore what he said and make a joke of a serious argument

So are you saying that he doesn't have the right to make a joke now?? Are we going to make a law of that, that will say no joking in a serious arguement? It is his article afterall.

It pains me to see other peoples' well thought out arguments dismissed like that. At least most of those opposing your view take the time to fully read and fully respond to your thoughts.

Oh, and by the way, he's not the only one who's been joking aroundin here either. Maybe you just didn't see it or something.

~carebear~

118

wnx_decoy

on Aug 06, 2004

"citahellion's impressive, well thought out explanation of why we believe that gay people who have become born again are supressing their TRUE NATURE, including a great metaphor in the idea of wearing women's clothing does not make you a woman. It also explains not just WHY we think this way, but also what exactly it IS that we think."

Is that a quote? I'm sorry if I just don't read the replies like a gentleman would but I don't remember this being said... If not I'm sorry, I just thought that the yellow box meant you quoted something.

Man, I'm getting tired of this. All you guys do is smack the Christians in the face. Dude (or dudette) it's not cool. Have I once said, you aethiests suck and should come crying to me because you're worthless? I don't think so, and I'd really apreciate it if you'd stop trying to make it look like I did. The only think I've said is that gays shouldn't marry in Churches or courtrooms. Sure, courtrooms might have been a bit much but I never said gays are evil or anything like that. I just know that a "Christian" church wouldn't allow it and the problem is that I've seen churches allow it.

Have you heard about the Lutherans? They're thinking of accepting gay marriages. One of my friends told me about this. Guess what else? He's against it.

Just because christians typically think a certain way, we don't all. All I'm trying to say here is that I'm against gay marriage and that my church is too.

Again, can we get back to the moment of silence topic? Come on guys, I know talking about how evil I am is more fun but let's stop being cocky for just a minute. I promise it won't hurt you.

I think we all need a moment of silence now. You seem to be getting really good at bashing me. I think you're getting too personal now. I've been generalizing my coments. Maybe you guys should stop picking me out to bash when we all know there's no need for it.

Just in case this starts to get out of hand, how about this... We just say I win because I'm too inferior (due to my fear of God) to listen to reasoning. My tiny brain can't compete with yours.

Capt. over and out!

119

carebear07

on Aug 06, 2004

Well this is a little too much to put in a yellow box so I'm not going to bother.....

Yeah I'm getting tired too. Why do you always have to smack us Christians in the face. Why not yourslef for a change? You ever stop to think that you could be wrong too? You're making us Christians look like idiots or something. I know none of us have tried to bash you or anything. Maybe it's time we should?? Or maybe not, because that's just wrong. And yes my church is also against gay marriage and so am I, but I think we already know that one. And yes, could we stop trying to or acting cocky? And Capt. you're not the only on getting bashed. And yeah they are getting a wee bit too personal.

~carebear~

120

Lord Shitzu

on Aug 06, 2004

Now, to take actual issue with your point, you have to realize that there is a difference between changing your behavior and changing your being.
If today I declare that I like cerulean best, and tomorrow I decide I like obsidian best, am I really just a closet cerulean lover who is suppressing my instincts? No, I have changed my mind. I have found a new reason to prefer something else over my previous choice.
On the other hand, if today I dress like a man and tomorrow I dress like a woman, do I become a woman? I hope not. (Perhaps I shouldn't take the risk, though.)

A lot of religion is about making a decision to behaviorally suppress elements of your being. A person who is violent by nature but who is a Christian is called upon to constantly suppress his violent instincts and instead to turn the other cheek. A person who is innately greedy and envious is called upon to renounce those tendencies and try to focus on generosity and gratitude. Hormone-drenched teens are called upon to hold their gonads in check until they find someone they're willing to marry.
Now when you joined the church, did you get castrated? If you did, then you are truly no longer a hormone-drenched teen and your sinful desires in that regard have indeed been eradicated. If not, you are just like the homosexual Christian; having desires, but pledged not to act upon them.

There's the quote, I was paraphrasing the contents for you since you were too lazy to read it the first time, I figured you would be the second time too.

My apologies.

And carebear, I think it's hilarious how all you do is repeat what CaptCornbread says to "emphasize his point." Stellar, way to think for yourself.

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